The 4 Problematic Sacrileges of This Server

Discussion in 'Server Discussion' started by hmj, Nov 5, 2019 at 1:16 AM.

  1. hmj

    hmj Donator

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    Nowadays, the server is losing players at an alarming rate. This is no hidden secret; we all know that this server is approaching its final days and that there's no way to cancel that. The owners have publicly and privately said that they do not care anymore about this server. It has become very clear that it is being kept up as a way to provide income to the owners. The point of this thread is not to talk about this, because frankly, if any server owner tells you at the current day that they're keeping the server up for any other reason than money, they're a bullshitter. Rather, what I'm here to talk about is the atmosphere that reigns around this place.

    Act 1
    The irrational and odious deactivation of core game mechanics

    In the past few weeks, I've been gaining a bigger interest in starting to play Minecraft seriously again. What caught my attention the most was anarchy servers. I had been watching a lot of YouTube content regarding 2b2t. Not wanting to fight 1000+ player queues whenever I wanted to play or spend 20$ a month for a Minecraft server, I opted for a smaller anarchy server called 9b9t. If you're unfamiliar with the concept or anarchy servers, you're pretty much free to do whatever the fuck you want. Wanna grief? Go ahead. Wanna hack? Go ahead. Wanna be toxic? Go ahead. This leaves you with a very complete sense of freedom to do whatever the fuck you want. After having a vanilla experience on 9b9t for a few days and getting tired of the pure vanilla experience, I decided I'd give Factions a new chance on J&H as it's a very strategy-filled, near anarchic minigame... right? After playing for a while and mining for around 10 minutes straight without any success and asking chat, I came to the realization that you guys had disabled diamond ores and the nether. Furthermore, you banned insiding, bitch claiming and lava casts. The point of playing factions is to be able to play the game as intended. Disabling the nether (therefore, easy long-distance travelling) and diamond ores (therefore breaking the game and making it more stupid to play because you're too lazy to ban x-rayers) makes the game simply not fun. You're stripping the game from its core mechanics and strategy for the sake of preventing a few people from hacking and making bases harder to raid. Factions is becoming all about being in the team that has the most kits and has spent the most money on the server. Which brings me to...

    Act 2
    Pay-2-win
    You are actively hunting new players out of your server with a stupid mechanic that is based around making the most money with the smallest amount of people. You will make people spend money on kits, crate keys or whatever frivolous triviality you can think about that will give them an unfair advantage over other players only to give the top players a negligible amount back with one of your oh-almighty valueless server store gift cards. Not only does this make new players completely uninterested in playing on your server, but it makes the active and loyal players feel robbed. The people who you actually manage to trap in your money-making pay-2-win loophole are slowly coming out of it and realizing it's retarded and fraudulent. If you decided to make donations actually cosmetic and not pay-2-win, maybe players would be more inclined to donate to support the server and new players would not automatically log out due to the disadvantage they naturally have over other players. Resetting the map won't help this issue either. More on that in the next point.

    Act 3
    The shortfall of future history for the server
    One of the things that make a server so rich and fun to play on is the history and culture that developed on it through the years of its existence. This is one of the things that make servers like 2b2t survive on the same map for over 10 years and still pull thousands of players: the relics and history that exist on this map are worth more than anything a reset could bring. We had this sense of culture and history with the old creative maps near spawn. Seeing the spawn plots from 2013, finding relics and secrets from players who haven't played in years was always something that kept people coming back and made people want to be an active player on this server. This is, personally, what bothered me the most about the intense hunt for illegal/god items in creative near 2015, and also what made me panic at the original survival and creative resets. Nowadays, the server pretty much as no relic of its past anymore. Old players do not want to come back and stay here because there's nothing that will bring them nostalgia or memories anymore. New players just find new maps without any soul and play on something that they know will reset or go dead in a negligible amount of time. Why do you expect people to still want to play on this atmosphere? All we have is a monotone shell of a server that has nothing to do with what it once was, and despite that, a small percentage of the people playing here take themselves very, very seriously.

    Act 4
    Solemnity

    Staff members (especially on the higher register of ranks and power) tend to take themselves seriously to a full other level. If you sneeze too hard, you're going to have a 10 minute mute or a virtual point that lasts 30 days and stays in a stupid historic that mods and higher can check. The staff protocols are way too strict for the amount of players remaining and I daresay there's too many staff and most of them don't bring any good to the server. This over-serious behavior when it comes to rules and behavior for about 80 players just bring toxicity on the server. Regardless, not a single owner or admin seems to agree with each other about what should happen on the server. The owners clearly don't give a fuck and the admins act like this is a top-secret governmental position. Just let the fucking players do whatever. Intervene when there's hacking or whatever but don't kick them off the server if they tell someone to "fuck off". It's a damn video game server.


    I welcome everyone to debate, add on, or speak about those subjects in the comments. That's a thread I had been wanting to do for a while. This will likely be my last serious "complaint" thread ever on those forums. I'm not trying to propose solutions or tell how to fix any of this, I'm just trying to point out what the problems are in my opinion.
    Thank you for reading.
     
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  2. ThiccTurtles

    ThiccTurtles Builder Donator

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    Hey. Nic.e
     
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  3. Bruhtrash

    Bruhtrash American Dad Builder Donator

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    yo go girl!!
    this is legit a longer version of what i said and i think its hot and i love it and you
    you're like... a flower?
     
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  4. amerixan

    amerixan Donator

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    should've made harper co-owner

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. DannyGlop37

    DannyGlop37

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    Completely agree. What I really hate the most is this...

    About 1-2 years ago, Creative and Herobrine's Chamber were the most popular servers. Creative was still able to get 60+ players at once, and Herobrine's Chamber was able to get 20+. During the weekends, Creative would get about 100+ and Herobrine's Chamber would get about 30+. But then...

    JerryandHarry released an update that just made Herobrine's Chamber stupid by adding rounds on typing speed, trivia, and looking at the right direction. Most importantly, however, as you talked about, they reset Creative. Although I was able to download the old save files on this website, it's still pretty disappointing that they would do this despite essentially no player asking for this.

    It's not just Jerry and Harry trying to get a cash grab. They're just stupid too. They just decide whatever THEY think is best for the server and simply disregard what the players want. Yes, in the end it's their server and they can do whatever they want with it. But they shouldn't be surprised if fewer players come to the server.

    I agree with everything you said; I'm just expanding on the topic. The server's dead now. Only about 5-10 people in Creative at once. Just remember, there are servers like Mineplex and Hi-pixel that are still very popular. I bet this comment is gonna get deleted because I'm advertising other servers... even though this server is basically dead lol

    Seriously though, Jerry and Harry can still fix this. They revert back to old Herobrine's Chamber. They can make change on Factions. They can bring back the old Creative save files. They can do all that.

    But they probably won't. Why? Because they don't care...
     
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  6. Eco

    Eco

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  7. Ezzerland

    Ezzerland Staff Member Administrator

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    I actually think listening to what players want is also part of the problem. Most of your biggest complaints, except regarding your desire to be an obnoxious troll and behave how you please, all stem from suggestions made by the players.

    Lets take the factions changes for example. Players here want factions to be competitive. As a result, they suggest changes that exist on bigger competitive factions servers. Creepers dropping tnt, removing diamond/nether, blocking bitch claims/insiding, etc. These are all things with reference to large scale faction servers.

    Resetting Creative or even Survival the last time both came from literally MONTHS of posts of players begging for it to happen. Yet we have players here like @DannyGlop37 who seem to ignore that and make up their own version of what happened.
     
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  8. MC_Scout

    MC_Scout Head Helper Staff Member Administrator

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    So the irony here is that you use what we've done to Factions as an argument to how we are ruining the server, but Factions has one of the largest, active player bases on the server . We implemented these changes because it's what Factions players seemed to have wanted.
    Anarchy servers are targeting a certain group of people. IJAH games have never been after that group of people. To change the server to an anarchy server would alienate what players are still here. You can argue that we're failing to adapt, and maybe that's true. But in reality anarchy servers have never been overly popular.

    This is very easy to say for someone who is on the outside looking in. The fact of the matter is the server store is exactly that, a store. Stores need to provide products and servcies that their customers want. Maybe you like selling and making salads, but if your customers want pizza and all you sell is salads, then your store is closing soon. Same concept for the server. Crate keys, kits and faction shit sells really well, and the people who are playing Factions competitively don't want something cosmetic, they want something that helps them win. We provide that product to them. You can argue that this alienates new players, and that may be true to an extent, but at the end of the day we need to have products that people want to buy, otherwise no one gets to play on the server.
    This is a false cause fallacy. You're arguing that the lack of nostalgia is what caused the sever to decline. Just because we got rid of God items, or removed something that players find nostalgic does not mean that it caused the sever decline. This is also known as correlation does not imply causation. The fact of the matter that IJAH has about 10-15% of the player base it used to. This is fairly consistent across many servers that were once popular. Even Hypixel doesn't pull as many people as it once did. Yes some servers are still alive and well, but many servers are a shell of what they once were or are completely gone. Furthermore, adding nostalgia does not mean everyone comes back. It's possible, and if you have something specific you are welcome to suggest it.

    This server has never had strict chat rules. This sever has historically tolerated a lot more than what most servers do. Yes sorry, you can't harass our staff team, make inappropriate comments, or spam chat. We also don't like it when people push the rules or waste our time and those who do are treated accordingly. People always complain about staff being too strict or abusive but no one ever reports it. Now the argument that the rules should be even more relaxed in some ways is interesting and we would be happy to hear it, but you have to be more specific other than that you think we are full of ourselves.
    I also find it very hard to discern what to take seriously and what is people being obnoxious. The people that complain about this stuff the most, not saying it's just you two, are the ones that often are causing the problems. People like to give staff a hard time, disguise it as a "joke" and "it's just a block game" and act like we're some overbearing parent. Posts like "Harper for co-owner" that are liked by people who are supposedly trying to make the server better aren't doing themselves any favors.
     
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  9. Ezzerland

    Ezzerland Staff Member Administrator

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    There are 2 real possibilities here.
    1) They are ignorant of the actions that caused players like harper to get banned and just bandwagon support for the wrong people.
    2) They are friends with and/or know what happened and don't care. They have no desire to improve the server and they just wish to troll or be part of the problem they lash out against.

    As to the rest of your post. You used the term fallacy and therefor the people behind the opening post will ignore everything you say because that's easier than addressing reality.
     
  10. Bruhtrash

    Bruhtrash American Dad Builder Donator

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    i just have to laugh at this
    "People like to give staff a hard time, disguise it as a "joke" and "it's just a block game" and act like we're some overbearing parent"
    that's because the staff fucking act like they're superior because they have special colors next to their name. you guys DO act like overbearing parents and get high and mighty with us when someone calls you out on it. jerome made some hella good points and of course you two admins have to disagree with most of it. minecraft is literally just a block game and nothing more. the community is dead and these people look stupid while in denial about the death of the server. no one wants harper as co owner, it's a fucking joke. even when i was staff i knew it was just to troll and get a rise out of the staff, and it's apparently still working!

    Joke Explained: a toxic blacklisted player would make a better leader than what the server has now. get it? because staff are full of themselves and have no idea what they're doing and the owners stopped giving a shit about the server? funnie jok!
     
  11. Ezzerland

    Ezzerland Staff Member Administrator

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    Sorry, where did I disagree with most of what hmj said? Oh right, I didn't :)
     
  12. hmj

    hmj Donator

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    Could you please give sources? I don't recall months of people begging for either survival or creative to reset.
    The problem is that this still pushes the obnoxious pay-2-win mechanic even further. I don't care that some rando suggested it or if it came out of one of you guys' asses, that's totally irrelevant. Point is Factions is now a 1v1 between PVPCats and whoever the pseuds who spent irrational amount of money on crate keys or kits is. I ask you: would you want to play Factions, how it is nowadays, if you were a new player? I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be, because some people who bought the biggest rank can get full sets of armor with full protection and unbreaking every day or so while you have to live with your shitty stone tools and leather armor. Nothing fun about that.
    I'm not suggesting to transition into anarchy, I don't know where you got this from. I'm using this as a personal example which is related to myself only. Also, the fact that 2b2t-based content on YouTube can pull millions of views and that 2b2t pretty much always has at least a 500+ player queue, if not thousands, and I repeat waiting in a queue, completely disproves your point that "anarchy servers have never been overly popular".
    If you're making the game shit for new players, these people are never going to donate. If you even want people to look into the store, you need to give them an experience that they will enjoy. Again, I ask you: if you were a new player, and saw that the server lived around being pay-2-win, would you even bother going to the store, let alone play the game?
    I agree that this part was poorly phrased in my original statement, but what I was trying to prove is that, for a player, everything is transitory at this state in the server. You won't leave a mark in the server history because everyone talks about it being a "dead server". It could somewhat feel like everything you do is "useless" in a way because it will all go away in a month or two. What's the point of being a "notorious" player on kitpvp if noone plays? What's the point of having top kills on factions if it will reset for the 78th time in a week?
    There are like 80 players still playing on the server, and probably even less still participating in chat. The fact of the matter is that the people who still look at chat do not give a fuck anymore. You scream at people to use /report when they see an issue, yet, surprisingly, most of the people who make reports are helper tryhards. Again, this is a video game server. If someone calls me fat on a video game server or says the N word in chat, I won't feel as offended as I would be in real life. Who cares if you tolerate more than oh-almighty Hypixel and Mineplex? Point is, the existence of most of the "stricter" rules, and staff's behavior to give as many warning points as possible is just laughed at by everyone in the community. You push staff members to give out as many punishments as possible, through the protocol rather than if the situation is actually problematic or not. In the meantime, everyone breaks the rules in chat until they see a mod online. Most of the rules have no reason to exist anymore with the amount of players there are. If I am a general nuisance to chat and actually bother people, go ahead and mute me, but if I tell someone who annoys me to fuck off or do minor trolling, chill the fuck out. People would not push the rules if they were not so stupidly written and ambiguous. I remind you that the rules allow you to say faggot, autist, retard or beaner but not nigga with hard r. You know you're not offended when someone says those terms in chat and neither am I. Neither is everyone, in fact. So why not just get rid of those rules?

    This may sound like me proposing an anarchic chat system, but it's not. What I'm proposing is to let the chat be and only use mutes and warns when a staff member deems a situation to be problematic and nuisant enough for people's enjoyment. There's toxicity everywhere, especially on this server, and I just think it would be healthier to let people have their toxic outbursts than try to hide them. You've seen me and the others be toxic in chat. We can always find a way to avoid the protocol. Toxicity is always here no matter what you do. By trying to hide it the way you do, you're encouraging the people to be toxic outside the server, to try and avoid ("push") the rules and you ultimately fail to get rid of toxicity. Let staff use their common sense with chat moderation and let the chat be.

    Oh, and for the love of God, please get rid of this stupid system that forces staff to give out as many warnings or bans as possible to get a promo. You and I both know that's how it works and no matter how much you tell me that this is not the only thing you look into, that's the effect it ultimately has on staff members. This is why most people see staff as "over-serious" and whatnot.
    I'm not trying to re-write the american constitution here. Just because I liked a post in my thread that made me laugh shouldn't invalidate any of the points I said. You know very well what and what not to take seriously.
     
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  13. Smg

    Smg Retired | ❤12-27-16❤ | Donator

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    Oh my, I remember when I could read long messages like these with ease...being gone for so long now, I can't pull myself too xD

    In all honesty I think the biggest problem with the server has been the deteriorating interest from those who make the stuff work. I've had this opinion for a long time, even during my tenure as a staff member, but at this point in the server's life it's not surprising to me that gamemodes such as KitPvp and Factions are the only ones receiving attention. The others are dead, or close to, so that part makes sense. I don't think we need to attack these staff members, especially with the team becoming smaller and smaller....if those people want to staff on a smaller server nowadays, let them. It's their life, their choices, and it doesn't affect any of us negatively.

    I've been here for almost 5 years. I have seen this stuff about "staff are abusing! staff are too powerful!" countless times. I have been on both ends of the argument. Even though I am disconnected with the community, I can tell that some things are still the same. If the situation is the same as it was when I was staff, then I don't think there needs to be change. There are much worse communities with worse staff teams. The server is smaller, but that doesn't change that rules need to be in place. It was either this thread or another where I saw 2b2t mentioned. That server is still alive not because of there being no rules, but because of the thousands of youtube videos made on it and that it's been around since the beginning of Minecraft.

    I'll be on my way now. Ciao
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2019 at 10:32 PM
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  14. MC_Scout

    MC_Scout Head Helper Staff Member Administrator

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    Even if this was true, I can say with almost 100% certainty that what sells the most on the store, and therefore keeps the sever alive, is things that you think are P2W. If we remove P2W stuff there is a very good possibility that people are not willing to purchase cosmetic items at a rate high enough to sustain the server. I then ask you, what then? I will agree that Factions has little parity. If you have ways that can a.) Make the server money b.) Keep current factions players happy and c.) improve the game play of factions for new players then please suggest them. At the end of the day we want to make the experience better. So if their is something that does so we would be happy to hear it. It's one thing to say there is a fire, it's an entirley different thing to help put it out.
    Factions resets have proven to be successful. You previously argued that factions has little parity. Resetting factions is a mechanism used to level the playing field and give everyone a fresh start. It's the same reason why organized sports have set seasons of play.
    The implication I'm getting is that you think this is something new. People tryharding for helper is nothing new. People being inappropriate in chat is nothing new. There has ALWAYS been lobbies that violate chat rules. I don't see how this is new, or how it's any different from any point in time in the server. Name a point in time in the sever and I'm guessing I could find people who constantly broke the chat rules, people who were bothered by it, and people who felt the rules were overbearing.
    You're going to disagree with me on this, but I think if anything the rules have become more relaxed. When helper program first started, and even when I first got staff, it didn't take much to get a warning point. And it would be a race to get as many warning points as possible. At one point the words "cancer", "whore" and "slut" were instantly warnable. We have relaxed the rules. Staff issue warnings when they determine that there has been a rule broken.
    I've been through every rank of the staff team, and I can honestly say I never felt the protocol pushed me to issue warnings.
    Because I don't speak for everyone on the server, nor am I in a position to say what would be offensive to people who lives a completely different life than me. The standard I have always used is "Would a reasonable person find this upsetting or offensive given the context of the situation." The fact is that just because you don't find something offensive, or your friends don't find something offensive, or other people making offensive comments in chat don't find things offensive, does not mean that it's acceptable.
    That's literally the point of the rules.
    I'm not trying to get rid of toxicity. I'm trying to keep it out of public chat. What you do in private is not my concern (WITHIN REASON).
    I don't know what system you're talking about. Activity is one metric used for promotions, that is true. But it is not the sole decider. In fact both Ezz and Harry can attest to the fact that I have always been opposed to promoting people to higher ranks based on the fact that they're active.
    There are multiple examples of staff that were active and not promoted for one reason or another. You can probably think of a few yourself.
    Please explain how staff act high and mighty. Has that happened in the past? Yes. Does it happen now? To my knowledge no, and if it does please give me examples. If there is some tangible thing we could do to improve the staff team I would be happy to hear about it.
    So by us disagreeing with Jerome that makes us bad at our jobs or high and mighty?

    I don't see how this is a relevant argument. Just because something is a block game does not mean there is another human being on the other end also playing that same block game.
    Dead would mean it does not exist. The server exists, therefore it's not dead. QED.
    And I don't think anyone is denying that the server is a shell of what it once was.
    Actually I don't. I see how both of you act in game and on the server. I don't know weather or not your're trying to troll the staff team or make a genuine point.
     
  15. Ezzerland

    Ezzerland Staff Member Administrator

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    Maybe you don't, but I'm sure @TheDiamondPicks and @Smg remember. If I recall correctly, they were both a huge part of the push for creative to be updated/reset. Back when people wanted a 1.10 and then eventually wanted a 1.12 world. Two months here (this was ultimately the thread that resulted in creative being reset), and a little before? This is just with looking at SMG's post history. I'm sure if I did a search, we'd find much more.
     
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  16. hmj

    hmj Donator

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    You somehow seem to completely miss most of my points and questions I've asked you. I'm going to repeat myself: if you were a new player, would you be anyhow interested in playing on J&H with the current systems that are in place?
    upload_2019-11-5_20-20-21.png
    What's wrong with a system like this?
    Of course, the positive effects will not be instant, but new players will be more inclined to join in and support the server. My whole point is that, currently, the P2W system actively makes new players not want to play here and that you're living off of the few people who are still willing to buy gameplay-advantageous items.
    It remains that this makes for an un-loyal and ephemeral playerbase. This maybe simply comes from different tastes in how we like servers to be run, but in my (and many other people's) opinion, resets should not happen *this* often. Everything ends up feeling botched and unfun, the only thing that keeps players in the server is, as I said, server gift store cards. Factions resets may seem successful in the first week or so, but to me, it just seems like people stop playing in a week regardless. Maybe there's a few top players who will buy crate keys, but you need to give something to appeal to the new players.
    Who cares if this is new or not? You completely missed my point. My point is that we're at the point where the community is so small that people just don't feel bothered by it anymore. My point is that the people reporting are practically only the ones trying to gain something off of it.
    You were already admin when the system I'm referring to was implemented. I'm not going to talk about it by name cause I don't wanna leak any top secret confidential information, but I can assure you that the staff protocol prioritizes people who spend 18 hours a day on the server and give out hundreds of warnings every month. Just DM me on Discord if you're still confused as to what I'm referring to.
    I also do agree that the rules aren't as strict as they used to be, but that's besides the point, they're still too strict and easy to "push".
    I'm purposely acting like an idiot in game or making fun of someone? Troll.
    I write an articulate complaint thread in which I welcome open criticism and debate? Not a troll.
    Need any more clarifications?
     
  17. Ezzerland

    Ezzerland Staff Member Administrator

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    Just want to pull this aside and point out that players like @Darkstorm77 were lead to believe that the system you are referring to would never allow them to be promoted with his state of "inactivity." The system you are referring to was also suggested/demanded by players like yourself, no? This isn't and never was a system that said "you are better for warning tons of people". We can talk about this in private if you like, but my point is, how it made you feel and how it's actually used are 100% different things. This has been expressed literally a hundred times and even refined to try and show otherwise. Anyway, just thought you should know.
     
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  18. Bruhtrash

    Bruhtrash American Dad Builder Donator

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    bro do you really need examples?? how about those times t3 had muted me for absolutely no reason like three times, me being banned for being an alt (bad example but it's still stupid as hell when EVERYONE on here damn well knows i am no alt)
    did i fucking say that? i'm saying that it's no surprise you're arguing with jerome. please show me where i specifically said that's what makes you guys bad at your job. it's implying that you're like one of the only people left that actually defends the server so much
    yes but do you get my point here? people take this server, let alone, the GAME, so fucking seriously and it's more sad than anything. Teenagers playing on here for entertainment purposes? ok that's fine. grown adults supervising the little people on here and calling that a "job"? sorry but that's not really something to brag about...
    ok i'm sorry but this is stupid. this server is dead. on a good day, you guys get 80 players, you can't sit here and explain to me that this server isn't dead or at least on its last leg. i don't have a lot to say about this one because it's just plain wrong. would you say that it's not dead when there's like 10 players left, or is that not specific enough because you want to make the server look as good as it could be with your little playerbase?
    and this isn't a troll. as jerome said, us going on the server and idiots is trolling, but voicing the truth and legit complaints about the server isn't.
     
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  19. hmj

    hmj Donator

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    Your intentions or the "reality" of the system are irrelevant. And yes, I do agree with the system and have agreed with people suggesting it, just not with how it works currently.
    The fact of the matter is that getting an "ideal" score in activity requires you staying online for irrational amounts of time on the server. I know you're going to tell me that you don't want said "ideal" score necessarily but staff are still pushed to try and achieve the perfect score, and you know very well that some of them do end up trying to get the perfect activity score.
    (you may DM me on discord if you are to respond to this. i don't feel comfortable publicly debating about a staff system that is not public)
     
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  20. Ezzerland

    Ezzerland Staff Member Administrator

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    Ezzerland
    "no reason" I'm a take a sec and laugh with you. No need to point out how stupid this is. Let's rephrase it to "reason I don't agree with", just like I don't agree with you acting like an obnoxious troll and then wondering/complaining about getting warnings/muted. It's stupid, pointless, and wastes both our time. But obviously, this is very off-topic.
    It's not stupid, it's literal. Exaggerations are as unnecessary as the emotional wording you choose.
    I am comfortable discussing it. I'll just change the word "currently" in your phrasing to "what I remember it being" since it's changed, as has the way they are presented.

    Staff members have always "pushed" to try and obtain mod or mod+. The blame-shifting doesn't suit your overall point of how protocols work to encourage staff to be as stern as possible. It's easy to want to have the freedom to say or act as you wish and to look negatively on the people or systems that hinder your freedoms. The hard part is deciding what lines should be drawn for the benefit of everyone. I have very openly encouraged conversations on this very subject.

    Anyway, I understand the sentiments you wish to convey on all of your points. I think it's a pretty fair response that it would take a lot of invested energy to change the state of the server. IMO, the community focus should be to motivate that.
     
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